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Dolly-type beach cart
With power to only one wheel, is there a problem with it pulling too much to one side? Clutch is a good idea...not sure if I can fit it all, or if I have the skills to make it all work.
Oops. Just realized how small the freewheel clutches are, and can come already mounted to a sprocket. Probably easiest to power the right side wheel (using a clutch) and only use the power when I need it. Again, hoping that the torque on only one side doesn't cause too many control issues. Would I need a 24 volt system since I'm not using the power all the time? Or does 12 volt just not have enough strength to drive a system like this? Anything I'm missing?
Thanks. I couldn't figure out where to do that....so I could get feedback from them. I opened a ticket to ask them some questions directly, so I hope that works. If not, I will do it your way! Thanks again.
ESP Support
Hi Ken, I can help you with your project right here. A 12 Volt system could provide enough power if the motor was big enough, however these days 12 Volt motors are not used on electric scooters over 100 Watts so we do not have any 12 Volt motors that would be powerful enough for your project. A 24 Volt system would work great for your project though.
You are correct about our motors not freewheeling. The freewheel mechanism would need to be located on the wheel or axle. We have freewheel mechanisms that chain sprockets bolt onto, and freewheel to axle adapters available, so nothing would need to be forged to attach the freewheel onto the axle unless you want to. If you decide to use a live axle then the sprocket could be attached to the axle anywhere and it does not have to be in the center of the axle.
A 24 Volt 8Ah battery pack would be able to propel the cart for around 30 minutes, and a 10Ah battery pack for around 40 minutes, so if you do not want to use a freewheel then a battery pack could power the cart for the distance it will travel. It seems like a freewheel would be a good feature to have though because sometimes you might want to push the cart a little without the motor, or be able to push it home if the motor stopped working. The only advantages to not using a freewheel is that then a controller with reverse can be installed so the cart can be powered in both forward or reverse, and that without a freewheel the motor will act as a brake and slow the cart down when the throttle is released.
Regarding whether both wheels or only one wheel should be powered by the motor. Since the cart will be used in the sand and sand creates a lot of resistance on wheels the cart might pull a little to one side if only one wheel was powered, however it would probably not be too difficult to overcome the pulling force by holding the cart handle straight. For absolute even pulling power a live axle driving both wheels would be needed though.
I found a kit item # KIT-328 which might be perfect for your beach cart at this link:
https://cart.electricscooterparts.com/24-volt-350-watt-electric-beach-wagon-power-kit
If you decide to use a live axle then I can make a new kit and add a sprocket that bolts onto freewheel, freewheel, and axle to freewheel adapter to the new kit. I would just need to know what size axle the cart will have in order to match up the right adapter for it.
Please let me know if you have any questions.
Thank you for your response. Because my 30cm Wheeleez wheel have bearings, a live axle might be more difficult. It looks like I'll have to do the bolt/spacer method to attach a sprocket/clutch assembly to the wheel (unless you have a better solution). I should be able to control the cart with power to one wheel when power is needed, and the clutch will help because my several-block trip TO the actual beach is slightly downhill.
Now, what is the difference between Kit-328 and Kit-145 that I original saw on your site? I will be putting the sprocket/clutch on the right side wheel (as you are facing the direction of travel). And, I'm not sure yet if I will place the motor behind the wheel or in front of it, so I guess I would need a reverse switch (unless the wires can be plugged in reverse).
ESP Support
The only difference between KIT-145 and KIT-328 is that KIT-145 has a reversing controller and a reverse switch, while KIT-328 does not have reverse. If you are going to use a freewheel then KIT-328 would be the best choice because reverse will not work with a freewheel. Also the reversing controller in KIT-145 lowers the top speed when it is in reverse so its reverse function should only be used for reversing purposes. The direction of the motor shaft can be reversed by plugging the wires between the motor and controller in reverse.
I will make a new kit that can be ordered online with the 44 tooth sprocket and freewheel. I just need to ask a couple of questions before I can make the new kit: Is a freewheel with 1.37" x 24 TPI threads okay? Also do you need a freewheel with left or right hand threads?
Please let me know if you have any questions.
Thanks for the info on the reversing motor. You're right, I don't need that. As far as the freewheel, I'm at a loss as to how that attaches to the system. I pictured modifying the sprocket with four bolts and spacers to attach to the Wheeleez (centered as best as possible), with my 1/2" steel rod axle going through the center hole of the sprocket. Will the clutch need to be threaded onto the axle.....in that case, is there one available with a 1/2" diameter? I'm hitting a mental block here....what am I missing?
ESP Support
One thing I thought of is to thread the freewheel mechanism onto a freewheel adapter for an axle, and then weld the freewheel adapter onto a flat piece of steel with a hole in the middle of it which could be bolted onto the wheel. Here is an illustration I made showing what I am thinking of.
That looks good! The sprocket would come from you already attached to the inside of the freewheel mechanism? So, the Wheeleez wheel and it's bearing would be the only attachment to the axle? It wouldn't be too much torque from the chain drive to pull it out of alignment?
ESP Support
Yes the 44 tooth chain sprocket would come bolted onto to the freewheel. I have freewheel adapters for 1" axles so as long a that would clear the axle then it should work. In you photo I do not see too much room to mount a freewheel adapter, freewheel mechanism, and sprocket between your beach cart's axle hangers and inside of the wheel though so you might need a wider axle and spacers to get the wheels more outboard to make room for the sprocket and freewheel. I do not know whether the torque of the chain would pull the wheel out of alignment, I would push and pull on the wheel and see how much it deflects to make that call. As long as everything is good and tight then it should be fine.
Yes, I figured I would have to get a longer axle, and I will make sure it's all tight. It is a 1/2" diameter axle, so I need the freewheel with the 1" diameter hole.
Thanks so much for all your time and thoughts. Let me know how you want me to order the kit with the modifications. I can do card or PayPal when you have the total and/or order number.
Ken Rohde
I attached two photos of a cart I have been customizing over the years. With the full ice chest at the back, it is pretty well balanced to lift the front and pull or push the cart about 5 blocks to the beach and 100 yards across the sand. With your motor kit, it looks like I would have to solidify the axle to the wheels, then forge something to attach the sprocket somewhere in the middle of the axle. Does that sound about right? Also, I have a feeling your motor set-up doesn't spin freely until the throttle is activated. I was hoping to use the power only on slight terrain and the sand. If not, my short trip out and back would probably not run down the batteries. Any thoughts?